Northwest Indiana Discussion

i was somewhat surprised no one posted this yesterday

http://nwi.com/articles/2008/10/13/news ... 0206a7.txt

after all some of you detractors have been clamoring for some of the info in this story for months. well here ya go...according to statistics from the state of indiana

"Nearly 85 percent of Hammond high school graduates went on to college in 2006, the first year of the College Bound program, compared to just 55 percent in 1995, according to the Indiana Department of Education."

that is nearly a 40% jump overall in the number of hammond kids seeking a college education in just the first year of the program. it seems college bound had an immediate impact on the educational opportunities afforded students in hammond.

Wasn't College Bound touted as an economic development program intended to increase home ownership in Hammond? Wasn't College Bound touted as program to attract higher-income, higher class people to Hammond?

How successful is College Bound in those terms?

It is great that more Hammond students are attending college. I'd be interested in learning what schools College Bound recipients are attending, what fields of study they are in, and how many are on schedule to graduate with a 4 year degree.

Don't forget that Hammond High Schools graduate a very low percentage of their students when celebrating that 85% figure.

When you bring up the fact CB was intended to encourage home ownership and start using numbers Oracles head starts spinning. Facts and numbers are not his strong suit.

Obviously it is having an effect at Hammond High School where any sign of improvement should be welcomed.

No kidding. Facts and numbers are not The Magic 8 Ball’s strong suit at all.

First off, (to use a term he loves so) An increase from 55% to 85% is less than a 30% jump, not “nearly a 40% jump” as The Magic 8 Ball exaggerates in his post.

Second off, he falsely attributes this increase that occurred over a period of ELEVEN years to the FIRST year of the College Bound program.

Third off, it is not a 40% jump overall in the number of Hammond kids seeking a college education. It is less than a 30% increase in the percentage of Hammond high school graduates that went on to college in 2006 compared to 1995. Because the number of Hammond high school graduates has been decreasing over that period, there may not have even been an increase in the number of Hammond kids seeking a college education over this period – it is possible that there has been a net decrease.


It is not a nearly 40% jump overall in the number of Hammond kids seeking a college education in just the first year of the College Bound program as The Magic 8 Ball of the Region proclaims.

It is less than a 30% increase in the percentage of Hammond high school graduates seeking a college education over an eleven year period from 1995 to 2006.

Since College Bound was in effect only for the last year of that period, it is more likely that CB had no effect at all on the magnitude of that increase than it is likely that all of the increase resulted from CB.

It is also possible, if not likely, that the number of Hammond high school graduates seeking a college education actually decreased over this period.

Once again, the information (I use that term loosely) that The Magic 8 Ball of the Region posts is completely, utterly, and absolutely inaccurate. It seems that correctly and properly interpreting numbers and facts is too much to expect from a community-college dropout.

It's too much to expect from a CE supervisor as well:

That number has to be made up by the SCH and given to the State in error. Just the State Department of educations own numbers would refute that fact ...

Below are the percentage of 12th Grade students TAKING the SAT and ACT ...necessary for college entrance ...

Clark 40% SAT 20% ACT
Morton 37% SAT 12% ACT
Hammond High 22% SAT 12% ACT
Gavit 34% SAT 17% ACT

The majority of students taking the ACT are also taking the SAT since Indiana entrance is based on SAT numbers and not ACT.

Hammond High also claims that 99% of their graduates pursue a college education. Clark only claims 77%. Morton claims 78% and Gavit claims 73%.

Numbers that have to be wrong due to the fact that so few students take placement tests mandatory for entrance.

So it would seem Matt. Unless the rest are all going to Ivy Tech or Saywer Business College or the like.

But 99% for Hammond High? What kind of con job is the school board up to with that?

The article says 85% of Hammond High graduates. I would bet that is not the same as the number that was used for the percentages Matt posted. It looks like Matt’s are based on the total number in the class. So maybe what they are trying to say is that 85% of the 30% who actually graduated from Hammond High went on to college. A much different number than what was implied in the article.

Dat, even by that math it makes no sense.

Hammond High graduates 39% supposedly ... so 39 out of 100.

Their percentage that takes the SAT is 22% .. so 22 out of a hundred.

I will go on the assumption that anyone who took the time to take the test graduated ... so 22/39 =.564 So 56.4% were even eligible to go to college ... let alone 99%.

I don't have the time to do the math for each of the schools, but it is rather obvious that it doesn't add up to 95%.

I agree the numbers don’t make sense but the inference that so many from Hammond High are going on to college is definitely overstated. But if those submitting the numbers are a product of the math taught in the Hammond schools these days it would explain a great deal.

No, the article says 85% of Hammond high school graduates. - meaning the graduates from all of Hammond's high schools, not the graduates of the Hammond High School.



You're close, but not quite. The article claims that 85% of the "x"% of students who actually graduated from all of Hammond's high schools in 2006 went on to college. As noted, it is possible, if not likely, that the actual number Hammond's students who went on to college actually decreased from 1995 to 2006. Also as noted by others that 85% number is highly suspect depending on how "college" is defined. That's why I noted that it would be interesting to learn what schools College Bound recipients are attending, what fields of study they are in, and how many are on schedule to graduate with a 4 year degree in my original post in this thread. Ivy Tech or Saywer Business College, for example, aren't equivalent to universities and colleges that award 4 year bachelor degrees.

College Bound is first and foremost a thinly veiled re-election campaign for incumbent politicians using public funds for their own benefit. It will not do anything to meet the goals of increasing home ownership in Hammond to any significant degree or of drawing more higher income, better educated, higher class people to Hammond in any significant numbers - the goals that they used to justify the program.

That one of the politician's bootlickers is distorting news items in a failed attempt to trumpet the program's success to gain favor from his political bosses is evidence of that.

actually both aspects were touted. although economic development was the primary benefit that was pushed it definately wasnt the only one.

the econ development benefits are obviously much harder to prove, as who can say for sure how much of an impact cb has had on this. however, i who live here and speak to fellow residents, do personally know of several dozens of households that have either remained in the city, or recently located here, because of the program...but as i said, if you havent spoken to these people yourself, its impossible for me to prove it to you.



hate to burst your bubble moron, but in actuality 85% is actually and increase closer to 40% over the previous number (which was 55%) to get the correct amount of increase in the rate of college bound graduates you compare the new amount to the old amount (which is an increase of about 40% more of high school graduates). not either amount to 100

im guessing purdue didnt do very well on the sat's himself.

With your history of failing to grasp the English language and your suspect math skills I find your use of the word "moron" when referencing another poster quite amusing. I realize it was unintentional but thanks for the laugh.

Households that remain in the city because of College Bound do nothing to increase the number of higher income, higher-class people in Hammond.

Several dozens of households that remain in the city because of College Bound do not increase home ownership in Hammond to any significant degree, even if every single one of those households represent former renters who bought a house in Hammond.

Several dozens of households that recently located here because of College Bound have done little (essentially nothing) to increase home ownership in Hammond to any significant degree, even if every single one of those households bought a house in Hammond.

Several dozens of households that recently located here because of College Bound have done nothing to increase the number of higher income, higher class people in Hammond to any significant degree. Higher income, higher class people are moving to nicer communities, not to a crime ridden, gang infested, polluted community with an abysmal school system like Hammond, even if offered an $8,000 bribe.


I'm quite happy to burst your bubble, moron, but 85 is 155% of 55, not 140% of 55.

The difference between “nearly 85%” and 55% is less than 30%, not 40%.

Either way you’re wrong - Just like nearly everything else in your post is wrong.

That is quite an example of a community college journalism school drop-out's writing there, isn't it bert68? Imagine - the author of that "sentence" claims to be qualified to provide oversight to an organization of excellent people with an overabundance of qualifications (30 years in the business, multiple masters degrees, a phd, etc).